'My windows were sealed shut'
For two brief days, the eyes of the world were on the Vatican. Cardinal Vincent Nichols, Archbishop of Westminster, reveals what really happened when 133 cardinals met to elect Pope Leo XIV

Richard Ansett
- Tom Loxley
Secrets of the Conclave is on Monday 22 December 9.00pm BBC Two. Add it to your watchlist
Ad
For a man who helped inspire Ralph Fiennes’s masterful performance in the Oscar- winning movie Conclave, Cardinal Vincent Nichols is remarkably relaxed about watching himself on screen. “I haven’t seen the film yet,” says the Cardinal Archbishop of Westminster, to give the spiritual leader of the four million Catholics in England and Wales his full title, as he welcomes me into his study, an enclave of tranquillity tucked behind the neo- Byzantine grandeur of Westminster Cathedral.
“But we did have a long chat before he played the part. He came here and we talked for three hours. Then I said, ‘Do you want to try on the kit?’ I went to get it and he got dressed, looked in the mirror and said, ‘OK, I feel all right now.’ It’s amazing being able to switch character like that. He’s a remarkable man.”

Ralph Fiennes sought Nichols's advice for his role in Conclave.
Nichols also hasn’t asked to see a preview of the BBC Two documentary Secrets of the Conclave, in which he plays a leading role recounting what happened behind closed doors during the real conclave that took place in Rome to choose a successor to Pope Francis. For Nichols, it was the highlight of his life in the Church.
A tall, softly spoken 80-year-old, born and brought up in Crosby and still carrying enough of a Merseyside accent to make sense of the framed Liverpool FC shirt hanging above his study door, Nichols radiates the same quiet charisma in person that he does on television.
He may not have seen Hollywood’s take on Robert Harris’s 2016 novel about the power plays, political wrangling and court intrigue surrounding the election of a fictional pope, but why would he need to, having been part of the centuries-old process that elected Pope Leo XIV? For two days in May, with millions around the world watching the Vatican chimney on news networks and YouTube, it was one of the biggest live television events of the year.
There was this shared focus on a remarkable task
Not that Nichols knew that at the time. Because, along with the other 132 cardinals who took part in the papal conclave, he was locked away in the Vatican – “clave” being Latin for “key” – living under a communications blackout imposed by the Church.
“When we moved into the Santa Marta [the Vatican guest house next to Saint Peter’s Basilica], I was given a more thorough search than at any airport security I have been through,” he says. “My phone was put into a sealed bag. I had a Kindle reader that I use to say prayers, but that had to go. I have hearing aids with a charger and they tested those, but they eventually allowed me to keep them. When I was shown to my room there was what looked like a convector radiator that I was told was there to pick up any electronic signals coming into – or going out of – the room. The wooden shutters on the windows were sealed shut.”
This enforced seclusion, initially a shock, became transformative. “It changed the world in which we lived for a few days,” he says. “It became an enrichment because there was this shared focus on a remarkable task in hand.”
The cardinals – some familiar to Nichols, others complete strangers, like the 45-year-old from Mongolia whose church is a tent that travels with nomads across the plains – had no choice but to get to know one another.
He describes the atmosphere in the guest house as contemplative – “we didn’t say a lot of prayers; that was all done in the Sistine Chapel” – and says they used their digital detox to concentrate fully on their deliberations.
“Unlike in the film, I believe, I never heard a word of anyone promoting themselves. Or the opposite. I never heard a word of somebody saying, ‘Keep away from him, there’s trouble there.’ There was a quiet exchange of views, but more about qualities than personalities.”
In the Catholic tradition, the pope is the successor to Saint Peter, a direct line that can be traced back to the original apostle charged by Jesus with spreading the gospel. As such, selecting a new pontiff – leader of the world’s 1.4 billion Catholics – is not a task to be taken lightly. “Everybody in the conclave understood the weight of the office of being pope,” says Nichols.

Cardinal Vincent Nichols. Alishia Abodunde/Getty Images
What about the American cardinal, formerly known as Robert Prevost, who now finds himself as Pope Leo XIV? “He showed an utter calm. I was about as far away from him as that chair over there when the conclave came to the decisive moment,” he says, gesturing to the corner of his study. “We all had a sheet to keep the score on, so everyone knew when the decisive two-thirds majority had been reached. When Cardinal Parolin came across and stood in front of Robert Prevost and said, ‘Do you accept this legitimate election to be Supreme Pontiff?’, he just said, ‘I do’. Then the second question: ‘By what name shall you be known?’ He said simply: ‘I am Leo’. In his heart, he was already stepping into his new life. Even his new name.”
The documentary shows the stove used to burn the ballots being wheeled into the Sistine Chapel, the chimney being erected to carry the news to the crowds outside, and a temporary floor being installed above the uneven mosaics so that aged clerics didn’t trip on their way to post their ballot in the urn on the altar. There’s also footage of the new pope, freshly clad in his white cassock (various shapes and sizes are run up beforehand), being acclaimed on the balcony of Saint Peter’s, seemingly in tears. “He was visibly very emotional,” recalls Nichols.
Of course, he might have been mourning his previous life. “You lose all privacy,” says Nichols. Even for him, returning from Rome, the attention was astonishing. “Coming back through Heathrow Airport,” Nichols recalls, “I was stopped five or six times by people asking, ‘Have you been to the conclave?’”
Why did a papal conclave captivate so many of us? “People are hungry for something that appeals to an innate truth in as much as, sometimes today, truth has been subjectivised. Everybody knows that there are some traits and human aspirations that are shared. And if they are denied, we get into trouble. Who is disinterested enough in politics and power to speak up for these things?
“There was a moment in the Santa Marta when one of the cleaning ladies stopped me as I was walking past to go to the Sistine Chapel, and she said, ‘Just give us someone dressed in white.’ She was expressing that sense of there being a gap, an empty space that needs to be filled to complete our picture.
“It’s the same thing that underpins the experience of being a parent – giving birth to a child, having a succession, a sense that life has got a purpose other than just me. And it’s going to go on: a promise of fulfilment.”
Which brings us to Christmas. Perhaps His Eminence will finally find time to watch Conclave? “It’s upstairs, I’ve just never got round to it,” he says, pointing out that most of his television time is devoted to following Liverpool. “But I hope everyone will watch this documentary on the conclave,” he adds, inviting us all to share the quiet deliberation and shared purpose of those spring days spent behind locked doors, sealed off from the digital whirl in which we live. A world without phones but full of meaning.
Seeing as God sees
Bishop Mariann Budde urges us to embrace love and hope this Christmas
There are moments in life when we are given eyes to see as God sees, and our hearts are opened to love the way that God loves.
In Washington National Cathedral, where I serve, there is a stained-glass window that shows a depiction of the universe. Embedded within it is a sliver of moon rock estimated to be over three billion years old, a gift from the Apollo 11 astronauts.
It’s fascinating to read the accounts of those who have travelled in space. What’s most striking about their reflections is what it’s like to see Earth from outer space.
“I had that moment of, ‘Oh my God, we’re all connected. The planet is so beautiful. What can I do to make it better when I get home?’” said retired Nasa astronaut Leland Melvin. “And in coming home, the things that bothered you? They don’t bother you.”
There’s a name for what Melvin describes: the “Overview Effect”, a cognitive shift that for ever changes how one sees oneself and the world. We might call the Overview Effect seeing as God sees.
Yet we don’t need to leave the planet to be graced with such vision. The most universal moment of being given eyes to see as God sees is when we hold a newborn child. Small wonder that for Christians the definitive way God invites us to see with new eyes is through the birth of a child: And this will be a sign for you. You will find a child wrapped in bands of cloth and lying in a manger.

Bishop Mariann Budde. Steven Phillips / Washington National Cathedral
What does God want us to see in the Christ child? The angel said to the shepherds, “Do not be afraid — for see, I am bringing you good news of great joy for all the people.”
The good news of great joy is not for some people, but for all. Jesus came to show us God’s way of love. For Christmas, wrote Maya Angelou, is “the halting of hate time”.
Or is it? Rest assured that ours is not the first generation to have difficulty reconciling the message of Christmas with the reality of our world. More than 400 years ago, in the opening scene of Hamlet, Shakespeare gave words to our struggle. A nightwatchman says: “Some say that ever ’gainst that season comes wherein our Saviour’s birth is celebrated… The nights are wholesome, then no planets strike, no fairy takes, nor witch hath power to charm, so hallowed and so gracious is that time.” To which his comrade replies: “So I have heard and do in part believe it.”
Perhaps you, too, have heard but cannot believe because of what you see. The disparity between the promise of Christmas and the pain of this world is heartbreaking. But if you’re like me, believer or not, you’re grateful to have this yearly occasion as a respite from hate.
So, hold your broken heart before God this Christmas. Hold before God whatever belief you have, or don’t have, or long for. Hold whatever glimpses of joy, love, forgiveness and generosity you have known. For they, too, are God’s signs for you that the promise is real. Then dare to see as God sees, and to love as God loves, as if our beautiful world depended on it. Because it does.
Ad
Bishop Mariann Budde has served as Bishop of Washington since 2011. Listen to her Radio 4 Christmas meditation at 12.15am on Christmas Day
Authors
Tom Loxley
Ad
Ad
Get the Christmas double issue
Too much to watch at Christmas? Let Radio Times do the choosing to find something the whole family will enjoy.
Ad
